revolution: Recent Comments

Comment on Leadership Ethos

Chuck King — Wed, 03 Sep 2008 09:20:13 GMT

Carm, thanks for keeping the discussion going. I feel the Holy Spirit is calling us "back to the future" even as He leads us forward. What I am seeing is a simple call back to the New Testament mandate. So if we rededicate ourselves to the honest reading of and meditation upon the NT message from Matthew through Revelation, the Spirit will show us the way forward. After these many years preaching God's Word, I see ignorance of the NT as perhaps the primary failure of the church, causing carnal responses among us that result in disobedience and unbelief.

Comment on The Mission of God

Carman — Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:03:59 GMT

Connie, I appreciate your comment. We are not denying that God touched people in Lakeland. Testimonies of people bear this out. Our issue isn't with what God did at Lakeland, but with the misjudgment of men, speaking primarily of those who went to Lakeland to intervene at the request of the host pastor.
Obviously, after Todd Bentley admitted to the problems in his life, he needs the love and ministry of close, mature brothers that will enable him to be restored. But we feel that those leaders who were asked to come to Lakeland veered away from what Peter Wagner, who led the contingent of leaders, said God told him to do. That is what our comments were being directed toward.

Comment on The Mission of God

Connie — Tue, 02 Sep 2008 13:38:33 GMT

I was listening to you on the Fortress today and I must say I was very disappointed that you would choose to exploit the Lakeland Revival in the manner you did. I had gone to Lakeland in April and personally witnessed healings. From ashes comes BEAUTY...Many were impacted across the world and took this home to their Communities. It is time we all learn JUDGEMENT is not ours but belongs to the LORD.
I WILL PRAY THAT THE lORD SHOWS YOU BOTH WHAT LAKELAND WAS ALL ABOUT.
In His Care
Connie

Comment on Whose Interests?

Michael R Fornadley — Sun, 31 Aug 2008 18:51:28 GMT

How can we ever learn what God doesn't want us to learn? A multitude of sins is covered by love. Jesus comes for a bride without spot or wrinkle. He has a settled disposition towards sin: He hates it.

Carm's post is like a good discussion between man and wife. We are married for life and took a vow as such. There is no back door. King David was nailed and he paid the consequences. We can't just get over these events as though they should be common and expected.

Certainly this blog knows there were only 8 survivors in the great flood.

A genuine fear of the Lord will happen. The remnant gets it. Who in this blog is totally transparent before God and man? How many coverings do we have to make for ourselves like the first couple in Genesis did?

Yes, Jesus paid it all but we are seeing what He paid for and it's not about movements or events. If it is then TV and Computers and Magazines are mandatory to be a Christian in a fellowship.

How many posts and comments are inspired of God? Each of us comments by faith. If you take careful notice of what happens in mental hospitals and detox centers you will see that those in charge refuse to hear the cries of he sick. If they cry out they are squelched with more days in the hospital and more medicine.

We will move on (Hebrews 6) when God permits. Our walks no longer rise and fall on these scandals. The loss that really hurts to me is the worship music factor. Same goes for preaching. Who's performing and who is called? Who is a hireling and who is a true Shepherd?

I am grieved but not like "I Am that I Am" is grieved. We have to stay tough and learn from the past 30 years that each of us stands or falls by the Author of our faith. True fellowship happens with posts like Carms here. Even home churches may not dig it out like this discussion could.

Forgive me when I talk like I know. Let's get this splinter out. Until we do, it's going to dog everything we want to be in attitude and disposition with every doctrine on any subject or any event or move of God. You guys are awesome so I beg forgiveness for all words that show my ignorance.

Comment on Whose Interests?

Darren — Fri, 29 Aug 2008 08:29:42 GMT

Amen.

Comment on Whose Interests?

Chuck King — Thu, 28 Aug 2008 12:25:32 GMT

Thanks for your ideas, Darren. We do agree. A huge reason for my commitment to house church is what you described. The family atmosphere of small groups where brethren really know each other is a much better deterrent to habitual sin that derails a person's walk with the Lord. Of course, one can still hide habitual sin for a season, but close community is our best friend in prevention of such failures.

And whether a leader or not, carnal, worldly behavior will eventually cause one to fail. Please remember that a friend of the world is an enemy of God.

Comment on Alignment

Michael R Fornadley — Thu, 28 Aug 2008 12:24:08 GMT

I have an 83 year old friend with whom I spent 9 solid years. Even when in Boone we were on the phone.
He graduated with a self appointed apostle Brother Ball. Ball was a break off of the AOG because the AOG didn't recognize him. He still sends Charles newsletters and is still rompin’ and stompin’ "doing" all kinds of "good" things but the authority went to his head. Big church in numbers following him.
It's quite possible one of you know a real apostle living today. Do you? Terry MaCalmon and Jimmy Swaggart hit me harder than this current episode because I love to worship God with good music plus their ministries touched more people.. Swaggart was fun to watch and get old timey with but MaCalmon seemed serious and most of the time not so religious. I think money had a lot to do with both men’s motivations but not when they started out. Sex can nail anyone anytime in an instant. No apostle or 50 prophets are going to stop 2 people from sexually sinning. It’s their instant decision. They can hide it for a while.
Carms question will remain until answered. Maybe the answer might contain in it the solution to still let those who need healed come to the Lord no matter the vessel He chooses to use as long as the ministry is based on Jesus Christ. Didn’t any of those millions watching have serious reservations?
Some kings did good in the sight of the Lord and some did evil. This is simple for me because I didn’t follow the event much and I wasn’t healed. If I had and was healed and now this, then I really understand Carm’s concerns better. I should anyway but for some reason don’t. Kind of an “Enron” thing. We must move on anyway, God cares very deeply as we move on. We can think about it along the journey but we keep moving along and doing our jobs. Carm, it is intriguing, how you have studied this. Pretty awesome really.

Comment on Alignment

Terry D — Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:34:31 GMT

I was out of town for 2 weeks in Washington State evidently when this was going on and missed it. I just watched a video of the whole episode with Wagner. Although he didn't lay hands on he definitely endorsed, commissioned, and brought revival oil from Chuck Pierce for Bentley along with others. Its sad to see the blemish this has on the body. Rick Joyner who I believe was one also who prayed says on his website not to judge too quickly. That Todd will speak again after he speaks to his pastor Bill Johnson. Should be interesting to watch what happens next.

Comment on Whose Interests?

Darren — Wed, 27 Aug 2008 23:10:44 GMT

I couldn't agree more with everything you said (wrote), except your first sentence. That is, if by "this mess" you mean leaders who fall to the kinds of sin that disqualify them from leadership in the church. I think the reason we are "in this mess" is due to two main reasons. First, the value of the mission/movement/ministry/task (choose your worthy cause) has been elevated above the value of community and relationship. If people are in close, loving, God-honoring relationships, they are less prone to going off course. Secondly, (and this is where you and I disagree) many people from the Christian community have become so hyper-sensitive to sin, that it is not acceptable for a leader to admit that they struggle with sin at all. So, if they struggle with lust or feelings of infidelity, there is a lot of motivation to keep it secret and try to defeat it in their own minds. I think we would both agree that this is a bad plan for overcoming temptation.

I would agree with you that much of the Church has become desensitized to sin - even permissive, but I don't think this is why people in leadership fall into patterns of sin.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Comment on Alignment

Chuck King — Wed, 27 Aug 2008 15:49:47 GMT

Yes, Carm, I agree. I simply cannot recognize these self-appointed "apostles". They do not speak for the church-at-large. Only the Head of the church, our Lord Jesus Christ, directs each member of His body. We are servants only, humbly sharing our gifts and callings with the church-at-large, not imposing our own "authority" upon anyone.